New kayak launch

[Heywood]

The county installed this down at Simmons Park. They are now renting kayaks, $25 for 4 hours. Sure wish they would have talked with someone that actually used kayaks before installing this. Then again, it might have had to meet certain requirenments for the disabled as well. Some crushed rock and sand on this spot would have been easier.

[Rik]

Then again, it might have had to meet certain requirements for the disabled as well.

That's why they did it that way. ADA requirements are a big part of the design of fed/state funded launches.

[Heywood]

I think HOW can make use of this as well.

[dunfly]

Do you mean a handicaped person could launch off this thing easier than off a beach. Hell, I don't think I could even launch of off it. I guess it is more of our hard earned tax dollars at work.

[Heywood]

Do you mean a handicaped person could launch off this thing easier than off a beach. Hell, I don't think I could even launch of off it. I guess it is more of our hard earned tax dollars at work.

I guess you could get someone in a wheel chair on the water a bit easier? Maybe? I'm sure there is some kind of standard they have to meet. Problem is, they made it so big no one can use that spot anymore. It was a good spot to launch and used to be a great snook spot.

[snooker56]

All that money and they prop the end of the ramp up with what? Is that two bricks?

[jbdba01]

Ironically I tried to use the launcher yesterday in the canoe. We tried landing into/onto it. It's pretty much useless if you are in a canoe and have someone in the bow. We didn't come close to going up the ramp. I guess that's why it's a kayak launcher. Not a canoe lander.

Then there was the question of how would I get the canoe off once on? It looked pretty tight to spin it around.

We did use the floating dock to get into the canoe though. Couple weeks ago my buddy tried to pull himself up - it was so so.

A nice shallow sandy area would have been better. I don't see myself using it.

Was that you in the green kayak?

[BrianW]

Looks just like the one at DB..

[jbdba01]

Then again, it might have had to meet certain requirements for the disabled as well.

That's why they did it that way. ADA requirements are a big part of the design of fed/state funded launches.

I would be petrified to use it in a wheelchair. Look at the left hand corner that has been eroded away - right at the entrance. There's about a 4" gap between the ramp and the pier. Plenty of eroded run off areas in addition to that.

Anyone have a feel for the dollars on this project? I'm sure it's out there somewhere.

Looks like a good intention gone bad.

[Evan]

So, the idea is that you slide the kayak along those metal rails until you reach the dock? And then what? Pull some overhead spin move to get the kayak situated on the ramp? And then what?? Hoist yourself up on the grab rails and drop into the kayak from above without tipping it?

Hard to imagine anyone but a gymnast pulling that off without a hitch, let alone a handicapped person

I've learned to double whatever I think something like this cost, so my guess is $50,000

[BrianW]

I think the idea behind this type of launch is to stay dry. It helps, a little if thats what you're looking for..I agree with Heywood..It would have been cheaper and efficient to lay some rock and sand down. Just give me a hole in the mangroves, thats all ya need...

[jbdba01]

So, the idea is that you slide the kayak along those metal rails until you reach the dock? And then what? Pull some overhead spin move to get the kayak situated on the ramp? And then what?? Hoist yourself up on the grab rails and drop into the kayak from above without tipping it?

Hard to imagine anyone but a gymnast pulling that off without a hitch, let alone a handicapped person

I've learned to double whatever I think something like this cost, so my guess is $50,000

Well...when I was there with my son and took one look and thought, "Hell I'll try it." First problem we had was getting the boat over the dock. He dropped the canoe on the dock and I said forget it. We'll go ol' school and use mud. That was a simple 4" lift/drag versus 1-2' lift on a floating dock where I'll then have to spin a 17' canoe.

So we opted for "plan b" and we launched right next to the dock. The only reason we used the dock is because he was in the stern seat and we launch the canoe stern first. If we would have launch bow first we would not have even bothered using the dock. (He didn't have waders.)

So on the way back we figured we would try and beach/land on it. We were greeted with a thud and didn't get close to going up. I also had my doubts as to whether or not the canoe would have fit in the width - we might of have 1" to spare on each side.

Seeing that I have a kayak as well, I can honestly say it looks pretty useless for someone who is reasonably fit and uses a kayak; I'll define fit as if you can get the boat on/off the car/truck you shouldn't need this gizmo.

I'm also having a hard time seeing someone who is handicapped using it.

My final conclusion (and $.02) is that the dock is somewhat useful (but not needed), and the launcher is pretty much useless to me. I won't be using it. The opening to get to the water was more useful. The poles in the ground to get to the water (there's about 10 of them) are just another thing to navigate around.

[Rik]

We had hours of discussions on proper launch design at the FWC workshop series I was a part of - the NMBTAG (No Motor Boating Technical Advisory Group). THIS design violates a lot of the things we came up with. In their defense, this launch was planned and funded long before we came out with recommendations. I spoke with the folks at the park and they were well down the road by that point. Typical fed/state money deal - use it or lose it (without regard for how well it is used).

The whole point of this design is for ADA compliance. However, it was done poorly. Everything should be in a straight line. Wheel down the ramp, slide sideways from chair to kayak and go straight out on launching. As we all know, any launch that requires boats to be turned 90 degrees in the launch area is a nightmare. The other part of the launch rollers is that you really have to keep your balance in check which is the reason for those long arms that extend out. It is nice to see that facilities are being made for the disabled but, if poorly designed, they won't be used.

Most of these launches are designed by people who have no experience using them. The new kayak/canoe launch at Turtle Beach was designed by an urban planner from out of state who, she admitted, had never in her life been in either a canoe or kayak and had only seen pictures of other launches. They seem to have in their heads that canoes and kayaks are light, easy to carry boats. I shocked the lady at the Sarasota Parks department when I had her come out and lift my kayak. Just lifting the back end that was sticking out of the bed of the truck shocked her.

The biggest thing any of us can do is pay attention in our local areas when these things are being planned. Talk to park managers and ask if they have things in the works. They all seem to enjoy the input but don't know where to go to get it. Too often, as is the case here, we know nothing about it until it is built and we're all asking "WTF?".

btw, that dock is manufactured by EZ Dock. They have a contract with the state and are making big bucks all over Florida. http://www.ez-dock.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Heywood]

If they dont advertise, we cant help them. I have contacts down there and never heard a peep out of them on this.

But like you said, they have to use that money or lose it.

[1okbyme2]

That will never be used. except by shore fisherman.
Maybe the park guys can fix it in-line like Ric said.

[shallow minded II]

Still think Grande Tours in Placida has one of the best ramps around. Open 8' "boat ramp" style slope with carpet on the ramp, fresh water hose nearby & pinic tables within steps of the shaded launch.