Would you and/or Have you ever hired a guide......

Groupdog · Post by **Groupdog** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 5:39 pm

well first of all, guides are paid so that you catch fish and I NEVER see guides going artifical, I fish a creek around double branch and see these guides every weekend at the same places, and i can tell you there isnt a whole lot of technique in what they do or how they find their "honey holes". they all do the same thing. step one: cast net alot of bait step two: find a cove or cut up in the mangroves, step three: throw a crap load of bait in the water, step four: they tell their customers to cast where the bait fish were thrown step five: wait for said fish to grab bait then start reeling it in. so if that sounds like fun to you then maybe you should ask seaworld if you can fish in the stingray tank, oops i gave away a secret spot. so to conclude there are no secret spots and a kayak can get more places then a guide could with a boat anyway, fishing shouldnt get that complicated and besides part of the fun of fishing is exploring new places, not paying someone to show you new places...geez just raise fish in a tank if you want a guaranteed secret spot.

Rik · Post by **Rik** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:18 pm

justabucup wrote: A good guide is a teacher or mentor that you should learn what is in his or her head not the X's on his chart.

So going out with a local guide is a smart thing to do it will make you a better angler.

Bingo. A fishing spot is a fishing spot only at certain times and conditions. The knowledge of what to use, when to use it, where to go under certain conditions, how to work different lures, etc. is what hiring a local guide will do for you.

Too many people are concerned about 'fishing spots' thinking that if they go to that spot, they will catch fish. That is fooling yourself. If you don't know how to catch fish, you can be at the best spot in the world and still go home with a skunk.

Consider this. There are a few guys that can go to Cockroach Bay (for example) tomorrow and catch plenty of fish. Others will go there and catch zip. It has nothing to do with the fishing spot but everything to do with how the spot is being fished.

If you hire a guide, pick his brain on HOW to catch fish instead of paying attention to where you are fishing. If you know how to catch fish, the location is secondary.

HellOnReels · Post by **HellOnReels** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:18 pm

I've fished an area probably 100 times and never saw the redfish stacked there like I saw Saturday. Not more than 200 yards from where I launched. BTW, everyone and their grandmother has probably launched there at one time or another. Now do I stake claim to that spot because I've put in time there and happen to find reds there on that day. Please give the secret spot thing a rest already. Unless it's a puddle in your own yard, I don't think it's a secret. Even still, if I pay $300-$500 for a guide, I believe I just paid for that spot. Just my opinion.

Rik · Post by **Rik** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:20 pm

Groupdog wrote: I fish a creek around double branch and see these guides every weekend at the same places, and i can tell you there isnt a whole lot of technique in what they do or how they find their "honey holes". they all do the same thing. step one: cast net alot of bait step two: find a cove or cut up in the mangroves, step three: throw a crap load of bait in the water, step four: they tell their customers to cast where the bait fish were thrown step five: wait for said fish to grab bait then start reeling it in.

Those guys aren't fishing guides, they are paid first mates. Anyone can chum up fish.

Swamprider · Post by **Swamprider** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:47 pm

I have hired guides but usually people I have wanted to learn techniques from like Brian Horsely. Most professional guides I know, have no problem showing locals good fishing spots. But be honest and tell the guide your intentions when you BOOK the trip and not on the water. I think you will find most will be more than helpfull. After all most saltwater fish are very transient a good spot today may be worthless tommorow.

Fishaddict · Post by **Fishaddict** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:00 pm

my simple answer is NO.

I joined this forum (and others) to learn where to fish, what to fish for and learn techniques that would enhance my enjoyment. That said, I have learned where NOT to go, what to fish with (No LIVE BAIT) and enjoy the comaraderie of like minded people. I have not been let down. I have met many who have helped me and have made friends and fishing buds with some.

I would hire a guide ONLY if I were in a new area and not living there.

JMHO

countryboy_ucf · Post by **countryboy_ucf** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:17 pm

Rik wrote: If you know how to catch fish, the location is secondary.

I am going to have to disagree to some extent. Location is just as important as technique. The key is knowing WHY you are catching fish where you are, and then HOW you are catching them. After you know what to look for to find the fish, then you have to figure out how to catch them. If there are no fish where you are fishing then you sure as hell won't realize that your egg sinker and big black steel leader may be scaring fish away.

As for "secret" spots... Its a myth. You may have lesser known spots, and you should keep them that way, to some extent. I like the "I'll show you mine if you show me yours" way of thinking...(especially if you know that person doesn't fish much in that area).

As for guides, unless you spend as much time on the water as they do you will not find the fish like they do no matter where you fish... Simple

Blindmullet · Post by **Blindmullet** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:27 pm

MrSpectaculous wrote:
Snookfinatic wrote:
Blindmullet wrote: Nothing better then a hottie in a dress fishing.
Where do you find hot guides?

Speaking of hot guides....I once saw Niels van outside a seminar for "The Adventurous Women" and I put a note on his window that read...I think your Hot and left my number at the bottom....And you know what...He called me..boy was he suprised when I answered the phone...I commended him for his fearlessness.This is a true story. You gotta admit he is kinda hot! LOL

[/qoute]

I wish I could comment, but the suits will send me off to band camp.

shamus · Post by **shamus** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:28 pm

Now in the guides defense.
We fish for sport, they do it for buisness. Someone from Vermont saves up for a trip ( even harder nowadays) they want fish in the boat. If they watch Sunday morning fishing shows they expect it. If I'm the guide they're be a wiffleball bat in the boat. I may not always use it ; but in order to do everything legally possible to get my client fish it would be on the boat.

Need2YakFish · Post by **Need2YakFish** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 12:21 am

I very much agree that live bait chumming is ridiculous. IMO it should be banned. The FWC just needs to answer one question - If it's ok to feed the fish in 'protected aquatic preserves', can we feed the rest of the animals also? How about if I set up some feeding stations for spoonbills so I can photograph them more easily? If this isn't ok, why is it ok to feed the fish?

The whole live bait chumming industry makes me sick. The people practicing it are not guides, they are fishing whores.

Rik · Post by **Rik** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 4:39 am

countryboy_ucf wrote:
Rik wrote: If you know how to catch fish, the location is secondary.
I am going to have to disagree to some extent. Location is just as important as technique. The key is knowing WHY you are catching fish where you are, and then HOW you are catching them. After you know what to look for to find the fish, then you have to figure out how to catch them.

Isn't that all part of knowing how?

My point is that once you know how to catch, finding locations is much easier.

Talltails · Post by **Talltails** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 5:08 am

For me, using a guide to learn how to fish or finding fishing holes in your home area is only stealing from yourself. Figuring out the giant puzzle that is sportfishing should be a lifetime activity. There's nothing better than finding that "new spot" when no one else is around.

Reminds me of a saying--"The journey IS the destination"

mikeB · Post by **mikeB** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 6:59 am

I was on an off shore charter a few years back and someone on board had a gps and was writing down the numbers of the spots we were stopping over. The captain caught the gentleman and said something like "either you or your device and notebook are going overboard, your choice". I mean the Capt. was seriously pissed! Can't blame him. On the other hand, If someone hires a local inshore guide and they get taken to every little cut from one end of Miguel Bay to the other, come on, thats no secret.

r3krobert · Post by **r3krobert** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:39 am

Groupdog wrote:well first of all, guides are paid so that you catch fish and I NEVER see guides going artifical, I fish a creek around double branch and see these guides every weekend at the same places, and i can tell you there isnt a whole lot of technique in what they do or how they find their "honey holes". they all do the same thing. step one: cast net alot of bait step two: find a cove or cut up in the mangroves, step three: throw a crap load of bait in the water, step four: they tell their customers to cast where the bait fish were thrown step five: wait for said fish to grab bait then start reeling it in. so if that sounds like fun to you then maybe you should ask seaworld if you can fish in the stingray tank, oops i gave away a secret spot. so to conclude there are no secret spots and a kayak can get more places then a guide could with a boat anyway, fishing shouldnt get that complicated and besides part of the fun of fishing is exploring new places, not paying someone to show you new places...geez just raise fish in a tank if you want a guaranteed secret spot.

To say that all guides don't go artificial just isn't correct. I've gone out twice with a local guide and never used live bait once. Furthermore, he not only took me to some good spots, but marked many more on my map. I think it's up to the guide and the customer to decide what's right. What WOULD be unethical would be to violate an agreement you have with a guide. In this case the MAIN reason for hiring him was to learn rather than just catch fish.

Bob

JKL · Post by **JKL** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 8:12 am

Talltails wrote:For me, using a guide to learn how to fish or finding fishing holes in your home area is only stealing from yourself.

Ditto, part of fishing is finding them.

JKL

Rik · Post by **Rik** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 8:14 am

Offshore guides are much different. Specific spots are very important. Anyone can drive a boat until a GPS goes beep beep and drop a bait down.

Learning how to anchor a boat over the spot is probably the hardest part of the whole deal.

I'm surprised that guy even got the GPS on the boat. Most offshore guys don't untie from the dock until you've sworn that you don't have one. Plus, most shield their units so you can't see the numbers.

Those fish don't move day by day, hour by hour. Season to season, yes.

Paddle-Fishing.com

Would you and/or Have you ever hired a guide......

Ethical?